Time For Acceptance

Hi Gargoyle,

As far as I understand it, Gillick Competence refers to the capacity of a minor to consent or refuse medical treatment. I'm not sure it applies as a term in family law regarding residence. Perhaps some of the legal people here can clarify.

But that minor point aside, there is no assumption that a minor automatically has competence to make a decision, and the practitioner involved needs to show that they have assessed the minor's capacity make such a decision, before being able to act on it.

Therefore, I would disagree with your statement that "he is Gillick competent to make those decisions". I'm not saying that in this case the child isn't - but it's certainly not something that can be assumed automatically. And, at 13, it is certainly starting to get toward the age where it would be viewed as a very individual case as to whether the child in question would be competent to make the decision. The child's age is one factor in competence; the nature and complexity of the decision, and other contextual factors is another. For example, in spite of having Gillick competence regarding health decisions, the law is quite different about anyone under 18 being in a home situation which is deemed abusive or neglectful, and a minor can be forcibly removed, even if they stated they wished to stay with that parent.

I think the job of the family court is incredibly tough in these kinds of decisions; balancing law, pragmatism, and strongly opposing points of view. And in the middle of this are vulnerable, angry, scared, distressed people, having their lives shaken up (both parents and kids).

Mummybear - I hope you find a new balance and can gently rebuild a workable relationship with your son. I know it will be difficult to try and let go of the claims he made against you, but it sounds like you're already doing a great job of focussing on the time you do spend together and making that positive and enjoyable for both of you. Let's hope that the worst of it is now in the past, and things can build from here...

Flipping eck Elvis are you my conscience lol.

Thats my whole point, social services write in their Section 7 report "some Family Focus work was carried out between me and my son" errr I was there and it was a 3 minute conversation which went something like:

Social worker to my son: " are you happy being at mum's today "

my son: "yeah why"

and that was the family focus work lol.

The same report has in black and white that allegations made against me were unsubstantiated whereas my counter allegations regarding father were substantiated and my son is now deemed as "in need" as opposed to "at risk" whilst living with his dad and yet still social services recommend an order be made in favour of the father. The social worker told me that I had to let my son go and make his own mistakes - am I really from another planet but is that the advice given to all mothers of 13 year olds then as I thought my role was to nurture, provide a role model, memories and experiences from which he could grow and indeed make life choices but with support and guidance, not here you go do what you please and if it all goes wrong you only have yourself to blame.

This is where my frustration comes about, yes easy to accept son saying "I want to live with dad" impossible to accept the box ticking protocol when we are talking about my own flesh and blood not a pension scheme or a shared debt !!

Some of you have already provided me with the strength and courage to keep my head high and be the "better man" (again I should be really good at that by now as better man has been my lot for years now). Gargoyle has helped in his own way too as without rattling the cage I wouldn't have probably have received the responses you have taken the time to make.

I have no doubt that my relationship with my son can be repaired and improved but I am not prepared to enter into foul means to ensure it happens and will let it be led by my son.

MB - you have a very hard road ahead of you. Social Services do not get it right and I so sympathise with your situation.

My daughter had a friend who 6 years ago was "persuaded" by her dad that she would be better off living with him. He was just out of prison. She has 5 brothers and sisters. To this day I have no idea (other than her saying she wanted to live with dad) why social services let her stay with him. That first Christmas she was so upset at being separated from her brothers and sisters that she came round our house and phoned her family from our house so she could wish them happy Christmas. She ended up staying all Christmas day and night because the only other option was Christmas down the pub with her dad and uncle. She is now 17 with a baby. Her mother is a shadow of her former self. The mother I witnessed was a competent loving mother who helped with homework and looked after 6 kids really well. I would like to hear the verdict of those social workers now on this child's life.

i feel for you, really do. i am at the beginning of a long road and your situation sounds like the beginning of what i am going through and will have to go through in the coming months....maybe years.

my ex partner said in court that my daughter is frightened and scared of me. the thing is, my daughter wasn't frightened or scared of me for the first 6 years of her life and right up until the last weekend i saw her so what has changed in the 18 months i haven't seen her.

kids are impressionable and unfortunately some parents abuse this trust for their own selfish sakes.

i've never once in my daughters company said a bad word about her mother as i respect the fact that she has feelings about her however much i dislike the woman.

all you can do is try. the consolation i get out of my current situation is that when my daughter is old enough she'll realise herself what is right and what is wrong. have faith in your son......one day he'll realise.

bobbysuper, my heart goes out to you it really does and as a mum I can't ever imagine trying to manipulate my childrens' minds to the extent they despise their dad despite the fact that superlatives could be used to describe of what I think of him. I long accepted that they are half of him and I love the whole of them so have to show respect for the half made up by him.... if that makes sense lol.

I can only imagine how painful the last 18 months have been for you and how a little girl somewhere is believing and thinking that her dad doesn't care or love her and that her mum is the only one who knows best for her aaarrrggghhh - where on earth you go to get help in your situation I really do not know, social services were as useful as a chocolate fireguard although very "nice" about it all and they talked about all the different "focus" stuff but it never materialised. Had from the onset of my situation a year ago tomorrow actually social services put in place the services they say they have on offer then I believe my son would be here alot more than every other weekend and I could still in fact be parenting him instead of being a fortnightly babysitter.

I'm more than happy to help you bobby in terms of experience and observations so just holla anytime.

thanks for your comments. i really appreciate them.

it's nice having a view from people who are in a similar situation. my wife is very very understanding of the whole situation but she doesn't know how i'm really feeling deep down inside. no-one ever will until they're put in this awful situation and i seriously wouldn't wish it on my worse enemy (even my ex believe it or not!)

got to now wait until febuary before we go back to court so another few months of uncertainty and being allowed to write 1 letter a month to my daughter! better than nothing i keep trying to tell myself!

argh! it hurts so much.

bobbysuper wrote:

it's nice having a view from people who are in a similar situation. my wife is very very understanding of the whole situation but she doesn't know how i'm really feeling deep down inside. no-one ever will until they're put in this awful situation and i seriously wouldn't wish it on my worse enemy (even my ex believe it or not!)

Sooooooooooooooooooooo true....but we can do something, just why the following thread is receiving no attention says volumes...ffs guys do you wanna bleat or do you want change...no one is saying dont bleat, but do u want change

www.wikivorce.com/divorce/Divorce-Forum/...it-for-the-kids.html

E